Rods: Length and Stiffness

Discussion in 'Tackle and Rigging' started by Uncle Russ, Jan 22, 2007.

  1. Uncle Russ

    Uncle Russ Senior Member

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    No, No. Don't start getting those kind of evil ideas.

    The question before the jury is this: I own, as some of you may know, an Accurate 50W which I may variously use on either a Calstar 760H OR a Calstar 7465H (6' 5" to be used only as a rail rod.) A good friend of mine (who lurks on this board but, unlike old Uncle Russ lacks the courage to show what a complete idiot he is) is very close to buying an Avet Pro 30 Wide. He is leaning toward the Calstar 760H. I suggested that he might want to consider the 755XXH instead--stiffer but shorter--for chunking and deep drop. I also said that I might reconsider which one I wanted as well. My thoughts are that it would be advantageous to have the shorter rod for fish-fighting purposes.

    What are your opinions, Gentlemen--not only limited to these two, but possibly others. Thanks.

    Russ
     
  2. Pope

    Pope Senior Member

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    The 760H is too light of a rod for a pro 30. Why get an 80lb class reel and pair it with that light of a rod?
     

  3. txseadog

    txseadog Moderator

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    IMO, heavier is not always better. If you get a rod with to heavy of a rating it will beat the snot of out in short if not used correctly. You really need to have good technique and/or be in good physical conidition to effectively use this class of rod. Most people under estimate how taxing fighting a fish with 25+# of drag can be if not done correctly.

    • The 755xxh is a true 100#-unlimited class stick and needs about 35+# of drag to load correctly
    • The 760H is more of a heavy 80# to light 100# class rod and is probably a better choice for most of the heavy rod needs in the GOM.
    A couple of question I would ask someone before recommending a blank would be:
    • How do you plan on using the rod (harness -v- rail, party boat -v- private boat, etc.)? This is meant to help get a feeling of how much experience they have.
    • Primary purpose (chunking, deep drop, trolling,etc.)?
    • Reel paring and how much drag to they planned to use would be at the end.
    • Their physical condition including height and weight



    No, No. Don't start getting those kind of evil ideas.

    The question before the jury is this: I own, as some of you may know, an Accurate 50W which I may variously use on either a Calstar 760H OR a Calstar 7465H (6' 5" to be used only as a rail rod.) A good friend of mine (who lurks on this board but, unlike old Uncle Russ lacks the courage to show what a complete idiot he is) is very close to buying an Avet Pro 30 Wide. He is leaning toward the Calstar 760H. I suggested that he might want to consider the 755XXH instead--stiffer but shorter--for chunking and deep drop. I also said that I might reconsider which one I wanted as well. My thoughts are that it would be advantageous to have the shorter rod for fish-fighting purposes.

    What are your opinions, Gentlemen--not only limited to these two, but possibly others. Thanks.

    Russ
     
  4. Deep_Sea_Gull

    Deep_Sea_Gull Lifetime Supporting Members

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    I would just put my reel on the rods my bud (Uncle Russ) owns and try them out to see which one I liked the best.

    I really like to try them before I buy 'em. Rods are very subjective.
     
  5. Jason_L

    Jason_L Guest

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    A couple of question I would ask someone before recommending a blank would be:
    • How do you plan on using the rod (harness -v- rail, party boat -v- private boat, etc.)?This is meant to help get a feeling of how much experience they have. He will use a harness,will fish the Big E > other boats,fishes offshore a couple times a year at least.
    • Primary purpose (chunking, deep drop, trolling,etc.)? Deep drop(not only for tuna but when also just doing a 12 hour trip>chunking,w/ no trolling
    • Reel paring and how much drag to they planned to use would be at the end. Avet Pro 30 Wide,drag wise not sure how much the avet puts out,but I would say at least in the 60-70% range of it.
    • Their physical condition. Handicapped Vet :) lol He would be able to muscle a fish,not quite as easily as me,but who could lol kidding

    .
     
  6. Jason_L

    Jason_L Guest

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    Now I might be off a bit but,think those answers would pretty much be what he would be thinking.Reason I could answer is b/c it's my uncle looking for the rod. I try and convience him to get as much new stuff as he can so I can go and pirate the old stuff lol :)
     
  7. txseadog

    txseadog Moderator

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    Jason_L,
    I forgot to include height and weight in my earlier response...
     
  8. Jason_L

    Jason_L Guest

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    6'1ish +-,about 240.
     
  9. Pope

    Pope Senior Member

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    I showed my ignorance. I thought the 760H was a 50lb class rod.
     
  10. MrBill

    MrBill Senior Member

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    I'm thinking about the super seeker SS-CTSF55XXXH. I do like to pour on the pressure and can handle 50#s of drag standing up. I'm just concerned if it would be an overkill for the GOM.

    Txseadog, I talked to three people over the weekend, and they highly suggest using the Winthrop rollers. PM me with your thoughts on going with the XXXH over the XXH for the GOM. Can the XXH handle a steady 50#'s of drag for a sustained period?
     
  11. Uncle Russ

    Uncle Russ Senior Member

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    Pope: Not to worry, old son--your ignorance could not begin to equal mine, and, compared to Jason's uncle, I am a combination of Albert Einstein and Leonardo DiVinci.

    txseadog: Jason is correct in all of his assessments of what the guy will doing and in what percentage. He is big and strong and probably capable of doing whatever MrBill could do with a big tuna--but only once. My serious belief is, that after muscling in one fish on 35 pound drag (a fish that would need that much drag, that is) about 2 minutes into the next one, he would be in serious need of a heart-lung transplant. Problem is, the dude thinks he is still a 20-year-old Greed God, and he's actually more like a fifty-year old Greek.

    Back to being serious, though, my thinking was that the shorter rod, even though stiffer, might be a better fighting tool for him. I bought the 760H for two reasons-first, it was made by Calstar for Accurate, presumably for the 30/50 class reels, and second, because, like the 700H, it seemed to be the gold standard among serious tuna fishermen. I just wanted this guy to consider a shorter rod for fighting purposes. Maybe though the XXH would be a bit much.

    My friend (and Jason's uncle) will be reading this thread for information, and I apologize in advance for revealing that I am more of a man than he is.

    Russ
     
  12. Snagged

    Snagged Senior Member

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    I've got my pro 30 on a 6455xxh and it works just fine. Just remember I'm short, fat, extremely ugly and frighten fish to death.
    ps: I use a belt and harness.
     
  13. Ragman

    Ragman Moderator

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    LOL Jerry! I never thought of fighting fish with that strategy!

    Uncle Russ- The shorter stick is always going to aid a fisherman in applying pressure to a fish simply because the fulcrum is on his/her side.

    Kevin hit it exactly in stating that correct technique is SOOO important to enable a fisherman or woman to fight and land mulitiple hard-pulling fish over a single day or 2,3 etc.
     
  14. Gunsmoke

    Gunsmoke Guest

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    Just remember I'm short, fat, extremely ugly and frighten fish to death.
    .

    Finally, an honest fisherman on the internet.
     
  15. Bret

    Bret Senior Member

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    Finally, an honest fisherman on the internet.


    LOL
     
  16. Bazztex

    Bazztex Senior Member

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    True Dat... what Snagged said... He Aint Never Lied!

    Gives them fish "The Look" and their done for. LoL :)

    Mr Bill

    I'd have to agree with Kevin on the 35# of drag on stand up "One Time" and 50# of drag is Ok..for about 2 minutes..beyond that you'll be Huffin and Puffin ah-plenty. Does the Big "E" carry a D-Fib box??

    It's a lot different fight with wide open bite on a Charter / Party boat. The boat dont back down on your fish or turn with it. You also end up fighting the extra drag of boat along with the pull of your fish if it gets on the down current side. I know you're a Hoss but it's different than a sport fisher..trust me.

    Bazz
     
    Deep_Sea_Gull likes this.
  17. Deep_Sea_Gull

    Deep_Sea_Gull Lifetime Supporting Members

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  18. MrBill

    MrBill Senior Member

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    I know you're a Hoss but it's different than a sport fisher..trust me.

    Bazz

    I never said I was a Hoss. As far as anybody knows, I might just be a whimp. I just like to keep a lot of drag on a fish. In fact, I think the rail is a pain in the arse. It gets in the way and makes it hard to move in a hurry. I think the main reason party boats started off with high rails is for safety reasons. They don't want to pull people out of the water and get sued.

    I'm not always on boats that are backing down. Most of the people I fish with just turn the boat to keep it square with the fish. As long as you have a solid hookup, there is no reason not to put as much drag as possible.
     
  19. Uncle Russ

    Uncle Russ Senior Member

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    I personally think that everyone may be right on this one. I have never fought a fish that taxed me physically, but I do know about strength and endurance. I have no doubt that my old strength coach, when he was in his 'twenties, a tennis player at 330 pounds and able to deadlift 700 pounds (back when 700 pounds was considered a lot of weight:) ) would have been able to fish way in excess of 50 pounds of drag, again, assuming he learned some technique. I have no doubt I could have handled 35 pounds for a few days when I was younger.

    Jason's uncle is probably stronger than I am, but he is also definitely about 500 ribeyes short of beating Lance in the Tour. Nonethesless he is committed to maximum drag. Today in the parking lot, he took my 665HXC with the drag at about 30 pounds and declared to anyone who would listen that it was not very much. Sheesh.

    I can't wait until he locks down on big fish and it pulls his a$$ overboard.

    As far as the rail height goes, I would never think of suing if I fell overboard and they had to fish me out. I might sue if they decided not to pull me out--after a long, long swim to the courthouse, that is.:)

    My thanks to all the responders. I hope it helps our uncle/buddy. I plan to stay with the 760H.

    Russ
     
  20. Ragman

    Ragman Moderator

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    "Today in the parking lot, he took my 665HXC with the drag at about 30 pounds and declared to anyone who would listen that it was not very much. Sheesh."

    Hey Uncle Russ- I'm sure he was just joking around, but that reminds me of a firsttimer's recent fish report where he stated he didn't realize how physically taxing a 52 hour trip was on the body.

    30#s may not seem much standing in a parking lot, but after a 10 hour boat ride in 5-6 footers, trying to keep from falling, loading gear, making bait, fighting a few tough as hell blackfin! (LOL), even 24#s can tweak a man! LOL

    Why doesn't he just register and get on this forum? We're all a bunch of kitty cats!

    Come on Jason_L's Uncle, start posting!