Non-assist Hook Rigging

Discussion in 'Jigging and Popping' started by ksong, Dec 12, 2008.

  1. ksong

    ksong SPONSOR

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    I got bored now as my offshore seabass trip tomorrow got canceled due to weather. As Eastern Tackle talked about Assist Hook Rigging, I am talking about Non-asssist Hook Rigging just for fun. :) I am rebellious in nature. As most guys are interested in assist hooks and they make thorough research and experimentaion on assist hook, I decided to spend my time to study and experiment old reliable single hooks and treble hooks for tuna jigging. :)

    Here are pictures of three different hooks.
    One is welded Owner treble hook and the others are 8/0 Gamatastu Siwashi hook and 11/0 Jigging Master hook.

    Welded treble hook a kind of new experimentation instead of using a split ring to reduce the line catch by the hook.

    The Jigging Master 11/0 hook is originally for the use of assist hook, but I felt it could be an excellent hook as an single hook at the tail of jigs cause it is extremely sharp and strong, and the gap is as wide as 8/0 Gamatatsu Siwash hook which is very popular among tuna jig fishermen on the East Coast. I used an Owner split ring to connect the swievel of the jig and the hook, but I am not comfortable with it. I am thinking about opening the eye of JM hook and attach to the swievel directly.
    But the final decison will be made by tuna, not by me. :)

    [​IMG]

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  2. MrBill

    MrBill Senior Member

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    I feel the boredom myself. Five straight weeks of no fishing or hunting due to weather, work and back ache.

    I never have had much faith in the Siwashi hooks. I tend to fish with lots of drag and am afraid of the eye opening up on me. Therefore, I don't use them. Am I paranoid or do they work fairly well?

    Also, what are the weights of those hammered jigs in the photo's.
     

  3. kidflex

    kidflex Senior Member

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    kil, have you noticed a difference in hook up ratios between the long and short shank j hooks
     
  4. ksong

    ksong SPONSOR

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    I feel the boredom myself. Five straight weeks of no fishing or hunting due to weather, work and back ache.

    I never have had much faith in the Siwashi hooks. I tend to fish with lots of drag and am afraid of the eye opening up on me. Therefore, I don't use them. Am I paranoid or do they work fairly well?

    Also, what are the weights of those hammered jigs in the photo's.
    Tuna opened up Siwash hooks upto 7/0, but no tuna ever opened 8/0 Siwash hooks so far. :) So I use only 8/0 and up for tuna jigging. I am going to test Owner's opened eye hooks soon.

    The two short one is 7 1/2 oz and the longer one is 9 1/2 oz.
     
  5. ksong

    ksong SPONSOR

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    kil, have you noticed a difference in hook up ratios between the long and short shank j hooks
    I useually used long ones. I am going to test them.
     
  6. BretABaker

    BretABaker Guest

    i dont think there is any reason that a shorter length hook like kil pictures wouldnt work, but you have to try it to know.

    the way hammered diamond jigs are rigged is a more appropriate setup for slow jigging as i prefer to do for tuna :)

    ive caught plenty on the 8/0 siwash with no problems while using heavy drag. i wouldnt worry much about that.

    kil can you measure the gap of the 11/0 JM hook to see how it compares to other hooks? i am in favor of big hooks for tuna since i havent seen a reason as to why they dont work.
     
  7. ksong

    ksong SPONSOR

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    i dont think there is any reason that a shorter length hook like kil pictures wouldnt work, but you have to try it to know.

    the way hammered diamond jigs are rigged is a more appropriate setup for slow jigging as i prefer to do for tuna :)

    ive caught plenty on the 8/0 siwash with no problems while using heavy drag. i wouldnt worry much about that.

    kil can you measure the gap of the 11/0 JM hook to see how it compares to other hooks? i am in favor of big hooks for tuna since i havent seen a reason as to why they dont work.
    In fact, I think the shorter,but wide hook has bett hookups.
    The width of JM hook gap is almost same as 8/0 Gamatatsu Siwash hook.
     
  8. rtran

    rtran Senior Member

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    I like the non assist hook rigging for small jigs as the diamond jig Kil has shown. Longer jig need assist hook.
     
  9. ksong

    ksong SPONSOR

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    I like the non assist hook rigging for small jigs as the diamond jig Kil has shown. Longer jig need assist hook.
    I am going to use a single non-assist hook at the tail of long jig and prove it is as good as assist hooks. :)
    I think nobody is doing this believing assist hooks work better as everyone use assist hooks for longer jig. Did I say I am rebellious ? :)
     
  10. Fishhead56

    Fishhead56 Senior Member

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    Kil,
    You are a reel outlaw.:eek:

    I put a pair of pliers to some of the Hammered Jigs I have from a local CT tackle shop. The swivles apears simuliar to the ones shown. The long shank J hooks and swivle were not as sturdy as I wanted so I am up grading some. The fitted J hooks and swivles seemed strong enough for 25 lb or so fish. So of the 20 I now have half will remain the same and the others will be rigged different.:cool:
    But to be clear.
    The Hammered jigs I have picked up only have weight on them and no MFG
    name so maybe they are not from the same supplier as yours.
    Kev.

    Still looking for more tackle to be listed online @ Jigging World.
    This way when shopping If I spill coffee i't will be on my computer
    not on your shop floor.:(
     
  11. BretABaker

    BretABaker Guest

    kevin - when ordering hammered diamond jigs, you've got to be sure to specify you want the 'tuna' ones and not regular hammered diamond jigs. the hooks and other hardware are much stronger on the tuna hooks. i'm not sure if you did or not, but there is a BIG difference between the two :)
     
  12. Fishhead56

    Fishhead56 Senior Member

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    Not ordered.
    Picked them out of a shoe box in tackle shop.;)
    I have spent quite a bit of time looking at SW lutes in the CT area and have picked up
    about a small suit case worth as there is a selection here that I don't find else where (TX).
    And relize that they are mostly rigged for the Big 3 biters of the area. Cod, Strippers, Bluefish.

    So I don't mind rerigging some of them to better suit the fish I would use them for.
    Kev
     
  13. Bellyups

    Bellyups Senior Member

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    KSong, Do you think the non-assist hooks entice strikes or significantly affect jig action? I removed my nonassist hooks and rerigged my diamond jigs in a typical assist hook manner.
     
  14. Bazztex

    Bazztex Senior Member

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    Hey Kil..

    I have found the hooks that have been closed around the swivels will all fail if you pull directly with the swivel wire placed against the hook eye opening. I have yet to find a diamond jig that can handle over 20# unless the hook eye is welded.

    I also found that used jigs that had any rust on the hooks lost temper to the point that the hardness was reduced almost by half.. so be sure to replace any rusted hooks before going after YFT.

    I RE-rigged some with conventional hooks for the Scat Cat trip we fished last weekend. I had no problem getting hooked up on Black Fin, if YFT had hit the Diamond jig they would have been hooked as well.

    I rigged mine a little different in that I used the swivel as my line tie after removing the original hooks and put a split ring and hook on the other end.

    I think using the diamond jig with a long shank hook will help with cut offs if toothy critters are hitting the jig because they have the length of metal jig in their mouth. If they hit the assist hook they are instantly in contact with your mono leader, but that is just my opinion

    Bazz :)
     
  15. BretABaker

    BretABaker Guest

    the hook on the bottom of a diamond jig is how its been used in the NE canyons for a loooong time. IMO slow jigging with an assist hook isn't as effective as slow jigging with a hook at the bottom of the jig. but thats just my theory - i havent tested it enough to be certain. as with anything in fishing you never know until you try it, and you never know what fish will like ;)

    i can tell you that the hooks/swivels at the bottom of the jigs (at least the ones I have) easily handle 25 lbs of drag and definitely more. i know bc thats what i use and they hold up fine :)

    where did you get yours from?
     
  16. Bazztex

    Bazztex Senior Member

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    Brett

    These were D-Jigs from several manufacturers..

    You are right on a straight pull they will handle some good drag over 20#... but if you put the hook eye against the swivel wire you will be surprised how little it takes to open the hook eye.

    I don't know if this will ever happen in a fishing situation?? but I know it wont on my jigs because I have removed the possibility all together.

    Bazz
     
  17. BretABaker

    BretABaker Guest

    ive had 0 problems with the 8/0 siwash hooks, but i havent tried bending them like that. if you are determined enough you can always make something fail :)
     
  18. Fishhead56

    Fishhead56 Senior Member

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    For the botom of Jig if I was to place a closed eye hook..I would prefer a Quality heavy split ring to hook connection. I just have not found "By inspection" an off shelf swivle supplied by lure mfg. That I like for the fish I intend to hook.
    In my current area.
    Beside the regular assist hooked jig. I have not found a jig rigged as strong as I prefer. On the same note Frenzy Popper is the only popper rigged heavy enough for what I expect for sale in this area.. Any other popper that I have purchased in the area I will rerigg. That includes Dicks, Cabelas and other local shops.
    But again that is not a bad thing only a local market thing.
    So.
    The swivle place above the lure in the line is my desired point.

    Maybe tomorrow I'll tell a few stories about 50 to 150 mile off shore trips with 30 mins to 12 hrs work and then waiting on weather 1 to 2 days to get back to the bank and hand lining Tuna, grouper, Hammer head, Cobia, Dorado Aj, and other friendly fin and toothyfish.

    It's a full moon and the Holiday Season so why not..

    Kev
    M\V HUMMBUG
     
  19. Bazztex

    Bazztex Senior Member

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    Brett

    :D Yep I see your point

    With my Luck it would happen.... I always try to eliminate problem areas.