Hollow vs. PE

Discussion in 'Tackle and Rigging' started by Eastern Tackle, Jul 14, 2008.

  1. Eastern Tackle

    Eastern Tackle Senior Member

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    I'm just wondering how many people are using hollow core vs. the PE braid?

    I use a lot of hollow for backing on my big reels, but I don't know about using it for jigging. Seems like the diameter would be too large.

    These were some videos I did a while back about splicing if anyone is interested.

    Part 1 YouTube - Chinese Handcuff Part 1

    Part 2 YouTube - Chinese Handcuff Part 2
     
  2. jureal

    jureal Senior Member

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    I don't use the PE braid but do use Tuf line xp 65#. To the tuf line, I splice a short piece of hollow 60# or hollow 80# Jerry Brown spectra ( yes, tufline 65# is spliceable with patience). To this end piece of hollow spectra, I use the finger cuff and serve with two nail knots which makes this connection system extremely stealthy.

    Btw, I watched your video part 2 ( part 1 would not load) and I have one question about the serving. I noticed that you do not exert very much pressure when wrapping the serve. I learned that you should make the serving with very tight wraps using a serving tool or bobbin. I have since switched to using the nail knot as it allows me to really cinch down the serving to the point of breaking the 50# spectra that I use as a serving material. The other point is if using dental floss, it is important to not use the waxed ones as the glue will not adhere well to the wax.
     

  3. Eastern Tackle

    Eastern Tackle Senior Member

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    Yes, the dental floss is unwaxed and becoming harder to find, but Food Lion still carries it. I rely more on JB's glue than the serving. I think based on my experience the glue alone would probably hold. I just put the serving on to keep the end of the spectra neat.

    So you are not using any glue? Just serving? All of mine have been set up for giant tuna in 300-600lb range, so I would never feel safe with only serving. But for fish 100lbs and less it will probaby work well. I will test my skills tonight.

    PS I checked Pt 1 and it loaded OK on my end.
     
  4. jureal

    jureal Senior Member

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    I do use glue. I quit using both the JB glue and Swifty's glue because it dries up too quickly especially in tropical humidity. I am not so sure about people stating that regular super glue will not stick to spectra. I use a form of super glue that is sold in beauty supply stores as a finger nail glue. The particular brand that I have become fond of is called Bondini nail glue. Last night I inadvertantly dropped a spot of glue onto my topshot where I had not intended and I cannot separate the spectra from the fluorocarbon. I find that a slow cure glue is best as it does not get brittle as much as the quick drying superglues. Water is an accelerator to drying and should not be used as it makes the glue brittle. Just let the glue naturally set and the glue is not only stronger but a bit more elastic. The bondini small bottle retails for $1.80 and lasts a long time. Try the nail knot next time. The best way to make the nail knot is to wrap it around a plastic hollow round coffee stirrer that you can buy at restaurant supply stores like Smart & Final. Thread the topshot through the hollow of the coffee stirrer and pull it off onto the spot where you would normally put a serve. The two tag ends of the nail knot can be tied into a loop using a double overhand knot and place a pen barrel or screwdriver through the loop and pull both tag ends as hard as you can. The nail knot will get so tight that the color of the 50# spectra will turn translucent... yes, it will be that tight. Glue over the knot and you are done in a minute. I put two nail knot on each connection.
     
  5. BretABaker

    BretABaker Guest

    The PE line has other benefits since the line is marked its easier to tell what depth your jig is at.
     
  6. Snagged

    Snagged Senior Member

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    ET,
    Video #1 has people doing something that should not be done. The tapered end should be smoothed with 600 grit emery and pulled inside the spectra. I've found that spectra will break at a sharp joint from the mono inside.
    You might want to try thined super glue from Hobby lobby.
     
  7. jureal

    jureal Senior Member

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    Snagged, you are correct. Since I shape the ends of my spectra into a bullet cone for easy insertion directly into the spectra without hollow needles, I have zero problems with the sharp edge of the mono inside the spectra cutting off spectra fibres.

    The glue that you are referring to is the glue that they use for rc car tires? I have heard that some folks use this too. The longer setting glues can be a pain waiting for them to dry but are stronger in the long run.

    Good point, snagged.
     
  8. Snagged

    Snagged Senior Member

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    Yes, that is the glue and it's CHEAP!!!!!!! :D :D :D
     
  9. Deep_Sea_Gull

    Deep_Sea_Gull Lifetime Supporting Members

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    Great vids man. Thanks for sharing.

    I like to take a lighter and round the end of my mono slightly before I slide it back into the spectra. The sharp end can cut the spectra over a long fight...
     
  10. Eastern Tackle

    Eastern Tackle Senior Member

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    Its been a while since I did those or watched them, but I would suggest trying the razor blade method I discovered when you are messing around one day, just for fun.

    Lay a sharp blade against a surface at about a 30 degree angle and pull the mono back against it. What you should get is a gradual taper about 3/4" long that goes back to a little tail. It makes the perfect transition inside the hollow core. no sharp edges.

    The little tail fits perfectly up inside the needle. for giants we are running the mono up inside about 10 feet. No way would I attempt that without a needle. If I could do it without a needle, then the diameters are probably not matched properly.
     
  11. Uncle Russ

    Uncle Russ Senior Member

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    We have a fly fisherman in the Austin area named Joe Robinson, who came up with a method of inserting the butt of a tapered leader up into the fly line. I have used that with great success--although to be sure, none of the bass I managed to land quite got to the 500 pound mark. Joe used the razor cut as well, primarily to get the butt end into the eye of a needle for initial insertion. While this rigging just barely passed my simplicity test (required for simple brains, darkness, driving rain, and pitching boats), at least it did not require bobbins and servings. This method involves only glue, with no need for servings.

    Eastern Tackle: With your permission, I would like to insert a question of my own here, related to other discussions we have been having among ourselves (in which I am hideously outnumbered :) ):

    If you wanted a smooth transition between solid spectra and a mono (or fluro) leader, but did not want to mess with the bobbin and servings (yes, yes, I know how easy it is :D ), how about using a piece of hollow spectra--say 4 feet long, with the solid Spectra inserted in one end and the leader in the other and two of the little crimps that are sold for this purpose? I don't recall hearing anyone on this board mention that method. I have talked to the guy who created that system and he abolutely swears they are soft enough not to damage guides. I guess the other concern would be whether they interfere with casting distance.

    Russ
     
  12. Snagged

    Snagged Senior Member

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    Its been a while since I did those or watched them, but I would suggest trying the razor blade method I discovered when you are messing around one day, just for fun.

    Lay a sharp blade against a surface at about a 30 degree angle and pull the mono back against it. What you should get is a gradual taper about 3/4" long that goes back to a little tail. It makes the perfect transition inside the hollow core. no sharp edges.

    The little tail fits perfectly up inside the needle. for giants we are running the mono up inside about 10 feet. No way would I attempt that without a needle. If I could do it without a needle, then the diameters are probably not matched properly.

    I agree with the razor blade method, but the vid shows somwone cutting the tapered section off.
     
  13. Eastern Tackle

    Eastern Tackle Senior Member

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    I had to go back and watch it, but Yes, you are right. Thats a NO NO. I wouldn't do it that way today. I would just work it, until i got the little tail back inside of the hollow core. Thanks for pointing that out. I also noticed the waxed floss in the beginnning. I couldn't get any unwaxed for a while and this must have been made during that time.
     
  14. Eastern Tackle

    Eastern Tackle Senior Member

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    One more note. I start and end the over wrap with half hitches today, instead of overhand knots. Its just a little cleaner.

    Maybe its time to re-shoot that one?
     
  15. Snagged

    Snagged Senior Member

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    One more note. I start and end the over wrap with half hitches today, instead of overhand knots. Its just a little cleaner.

    Maybe its time to re-shoot that one?

    That sounds like a very good idea. We all learn as time progresses.
     
  16. Deep_Sea_Gull

    Deep_Sea_Gull Lifetime Supporting Members

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    We have a fly fisherman in the Austin area named Joe Robinson, who came up with a method of inserting the butt of a tapered leader up into the fly line. I have used that with great success--although to be sure, none of the bass I managed to land quite got to the 500 pound mark. Joe used the razor cut as well, primarily to get the butt end into the eye of a needle for initial insertion. While this rigging just barely passed my simplicity test (required for simple brains, darkness, driving rain, and pitching boats), at least it did not require bobbins and servings. This method involves only glue, with no need for servings.

    Eastern Tackle: With your permission, I would like to insert a question of my own here, related to other discussions we have been having among ourselves (in which I am hideously outnumbered :) ):

    If you wanted a smooth transition between solid spectra and a mono (or fluro) leader, but did not want to mess with the bobbin and servings (yes, yes, I know how easy it is :D ), how about using a piece of hollow spectra--say 4 feet long, with the solid Spectra inserted in one end and the leader in the other and two of the little crimps that are sold for this purpose? I don't recall hearing anyone on this board mention that method. I have talked to the guy who created that system and he abolutely swears they are soft enough not to damage guides. I guess the other concern would be whether they interfere with casting distance.

    Russ

    I have one things against crimps. You replace them after each trip. Most metals rust, corrode or otherwise dissolve in salt water...

    Plus, you need another box of crimps and another set of crimpers to carry...
     
  17. jureal

    jureal Senior Member

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    Another way that does not require the needles is to open up the id of the spectra with a doubled up piece of stainless single strand wire. You would be surprised at how easily the mono leader will go through....as long as you first round out the end of the mono into a cone shape with 4-way nail file.

    Has anyone experimented with the holding power of various glues ( ie jb glue, swifty's glue, rc model tire glue, finger nail glue) on materials like spectra, mono and fluorocarbon lines? I know that glues like JB and Swifty's claim that the others will not stick to spectra. Pricewise, both the JB and Swifty's cost about $ 30 whereas the finger nail glues and rc tire glues are less than $2. Personally, I don't mind spending the extra money but not if the stuff does not last in the bottle and will soon harden out to a point of being completely useless. Now, the nail glues and the tire glues will do the same but it lasts longer and is so cheap that .... well, who cares?
     
  18. Snagged

    Snagged Senior Member

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    Keep your glue in the refigirator
     
  19. jureal

    jureal Senior Member

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    Not always feasible to refrigerate the glue. Hardening comes from contamination with water. In high humid areas where I fish, the glue is toast after one trip.

    The crimps were designed to be changed out frequently. On long range trips, we typically change the topshots after each big fish. Crimps are not left on the reel for long periods of time.

    If you do not like the crimps, think about switching to the nail knot.

    Here is another version by Gary Teraoka, an accurate pro.

    Fishing with Gary Teraoka

    I did a tutorial on this subject but cannot get it to work here. If interested, pm me and I will give you the link.