Glueless Solid to Hollow Spectra Splice Full Strength

Discussion in 'Tackle and Rigging' started by pametfisher, Feb 21, 2009.

  1. pametfisher

    pametfisher Senior Member

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    Note: I have posted additional Photos later in the thread.

    It can be useful to add Hollow Spectra to the end of a solid Spectra main line. This could allow for loop to loop attachment of leaders or more line.

    Attached is a photo of 60# Jerry Brown Hollow spliced to 55# Daiwa Boat Braid. It holds full strength. But even with closely matched lines, there is still a very slight difference of stretch between the solid and the hollow. This means that the splice can creep ever so slightly after 20 - 30 100% load cycles. Although this should not be a problem in use, I added a safety Uni Knot at the end of the solid spectra line so that you can tell if there has been any movement.

    Simple Instructions (when I get time I'll do a photo sequence):

    This is a 3' (or more if you like) splice of solid Spectra braid into closely matched Jerry Brown Hollow Core Spectra. If you match the size of the hollow and size of the solid closely, the difference in rates of stretch is tiny and the splice only shifts about 0.1% under 100% load (most drags are set at 25% to 33%). (I have tested this with a 1' insertion and it holds if the lines are closely matched.)

    So start by inserting the Solid one foot in from the end of the JB Hollow so that a 1' tag is hanging for a Uni Knot serve later. Pull the solid into the hollow 3' and pull a foot of Solid out the side wall at the end of the splice. This isn't needed for strength but is used to form a safety. Tie the Uni safety an inch beyond where the solid exits the splice. Bury a 1/2" tag from the Uni safety knot back into the JB. (If the Uni tag pops out, the splice has moved a half inch. It is still 100% strong but you should readjust it. This solves the potential differential stretch problem.)

    Now, smooth out the splice area so the hollow is tightly on top of the solid inside it. Take the 1' of Hollow Spectra at the start of the splice and tie a Uni Knot Serve, VERY tightly, at the solid/hollow interface. (This Uni Knot serve, tied with the hollow-line tag, can be tied so that it is directly over the end of the serve; or works okay even if it pulls onto the solid core. The best way to make this Uni knot is at the 2 minute 30 second point of:
    P.R. Bobbin Knot)

    One last note: I have not shown how to make the end-loop splice. This end loop can be made small or large. If you're casting a lot, you may want it to be as small as a dime. The end-loop splice is easier, more reliable, stronger and easier to size than a Bimini Twist (a knot I used to use a lot.) BHP Tackle has tools if you need them (I use wire) and some notes on how to make the end-loop. It is easy to do and gets easier as the line strength goes up.

    Also, you could use this to splice solid to solid by replacing the end-loop in my photo with another solid/hollow splice.

    If you have the time to do this you get 100% strength compared with 70% strength Uni to Uni. This will allow reels to be loaded with metered solid braid but still take advantage of loop to loop connections.
     

    Attached Files:

  2. kidflex

    kidflex Senior Member

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    very clean transition. thanks for all your input on line connections
     

  3. Basil

    Basil Site Sponsor

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    Looks good Pametfisher...
     
  4. pametfisher

    pametfisher Senior Member

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    Looks good Pametfisher...

    Basil, I have seen this question a lot. Once a loop-to-loop has been put to full load, the loop-to-loop knot gets tiny, what is the best way to get it apart?
     
  5. Basil

    Basil Site Sponsor

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    Take one side of the loops and pull them horizontal; it should pop the connection open enough to separate. You may need a small wire to undo it after that.
     
  6. DEA

    DEA Member

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    So Pametfisher, let me get the gist, the connections are basically interlocked with uni serves then right?
     
  7. Snagged

    Snagged Senior Member

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    A round toothpick works well to seperate the lines.
     
  8. pametfisher

    pametfisher Senior Member

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    So Pametfisher, let me get the gist, the connections are basically interlocked with uni serves then right?

    Very good question.

    No not interlocked, that's the key. The second one is not a serve but a safety, let me explain.

    The splice carries the full load.
    The SERVE at the bottom of the picture pre-tensions the splice.

    Normally the end of the solid would just stay buried in the Hollow spectra. Because there is a 0.1% differential stretch between the lines AND because the SERVE is not glued to carry the full load (like in a Served Mono/Fluoro leader), I brought the end of the solid Spectra back out. The Uni at that end is carrying no load (although in an emergency it could). By moving it an inch or so away from the end of the splice you can see if it has moved. It is there as a Safety/Telltail.

    After 100, 50 lb. load cycles, my test had moved 3/4". And there aren't many (if any) knots you can tie in 55# Daiwa that will hold for 100, 50 lb. cycles. Normally, a 55# line would see a max load of 30-35 lbs. So it might make sense to see how much it had moved every four or five 100+ pound fish you catch. ;)
     
  9. pametfisher

    pametfisher Senior Member

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    Here are the step by step photos of the SH Splice. Please see my first note in this thread for other details and comments.

    You can make the splice section as long as you like. I have suggested 3' but you could make it 6' if that felt better. Once you have the splicing needle in the hollow core it only takes a few seconds longer.
     

    Attached Files:

  10. John_Madison CT

    John_Madison CT Senior Member

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    Pamet: I missed the photo demonstration part of this thread the first time. Now I understand. You can give me the most detailed text directions, but I don't understand very well.

    Again, great work. It really changes the way we can configure our reels.
     
  11. rance

    rance Senior Member

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    This will allow me to put much more line on my jigging setup and still have a hundred yards of boat braid out front to know what depth I am jigging at. Thanks............Rance
     
  12. pametfisher

    pametfisher Senior Member

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    If you have already read this before, I have had many questions lately so I've added a few notes and re-titled the thread. Otherwise, the technique is the same.
     
  13. SteelingHeads

    SteelingHeads Senior Member

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    If you have already read this before, I have had many questions lately so I've added a few notes and re-titled the thread. Otherwise, the technique is the same.

    Good stuff! Thanks Pamet! If you would still be willing to show us how you are doing your wind-ons that only need a 12 inch splice, it would be MOST appreciated!
     
  14. pametfisher

    pametfisher Senior Member

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    Good stuff! Thanks Pamet! If you would still be willing to show us how you are doing your wind-ons that only need a 12 inch splice, it would be MOST appreciated!

    I'm working on that now. First, I need to put a little more mileage on it. I'm arranging to have some local charter Captains run it through their gauntlet.

    My goal is to make a really smooth casting windon design for spinning reel applications.
     
  15. SteelingHeads

    SteelingHeads Senior Member

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    I'm working on that now. First, I need to put a little more mileage on it. I'm arranging to have some local charter Captains run it through their gauntlet.

    My goal is to make a really smooth casting windon design for spinning reel applications.


    We'll be watching for it! Thanks!
     
  16. hamptonsurf

    hamptonsurf Senior Member

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    So, if I am reading this correctly, in the end you get solid braid main line, a unit where the solid enters the hollow.....3 feet later a uni where the solid exits the hollow.....then however much hollow you want. Then, you do the sliced end loop in the hollow and connect your wind on....do I have this right? The unis do cause any casting problems etc?
     
  17. pametfisher

    pametfisher Senior Member

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    So, if I am reading this correctly, in the end you get solid braid main line, a unit where the solid enters the hollow.....3 feet later a uni where the solid exits the hollow.....then however much hollow you want. Then, you do the sliced end loop in the hollow and connect your wind on....do I have this right? The unis do cause any casting problems etc?

    It casts great, the Unis are very small and if you add 10 yards, they are far from the start of the cast, so are even less of a factor.

    The keys are: smooth everything well; tie the Uni where the solid first enters the hollow as tightly as you can, at least 50% of the line rating. This first Uni is the Serve for the Splice. The second Uni is a safety and I'm still debating in my mind whether it's needed. It does allow you to see if anything has moved.
     
  18. hamptonsurf

    hamptonsurf Senior Member

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    This is awesome....just in time for a rainy/choppy weekend off the water. Thanks!
     
  19. Grandpa21

    Grandpa21 Senior Member

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    Pam,

    Have you demonstrated how to perform an End Loop Splice using a topshot of hollow and smaller diameter solid mainline? I searched the forum with no luck. I could be missing something but if you could post a link to this I would appreciate it.

    I think I'm going to take your advice and go try going with #40 JB (hollow or solid) mainline (to get max capacity on a Stella 10k spool in hopes of still having a ABS of #65) to a end loop splice of either #60 or #80 JB hollow. Then use a loop to loop windon leader.

    Unless the #40 JB Hollow is spliceable then I'm not sure it's worth going with hollow over solid for this application.

    Thanks.
     
  20. Grandpa21

    Grandpa21 Senior Member

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    Pam,

    Have you since demonstrated how to perform an End Loop Splice using a topshot of hollow and smaller diameter solid mainline? I searched the forum with no luck. I could be missing something but if you could post a link to this I would appreciate it.

    I think I'm going to take your advice and go try going with #40 JB (hollow or solid) mainline (to get max capacity on a Stella 10k spool in hopes of still having a ABS of #65) to a end loop splice of either #60 or #80 JB hollow. Then use a loop to loop windon leader.

    Unless the #40 JB Hollow is spliceable then I'm not sure it's worth going with hollow for the mainline over solid for this application.

    Thanks.

    p.s. are you sanding (to slightly roughen up) the part of the nylon your inserting into the hollow for the windon?
     
  21. pametfisher

    pametfisher Senior Member

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    Pam,

    Have you since demonstrated how to perform an End Loop Splice using a topshot of hollow and smaller diameter solid mainline? I searched the forum with no luck. I could be missing something but if you could post a link to this I would appreciate it.

    I think I'm going to take your advice and go try going with #40 JB (hollow or solid) mainline (to get max capacity on a Stella 10k spool in hopes of still having a ABS of #65) to a end loop splice of either #60 or #80 JB hollow. Then use a loop to loop windon leader.

    Unless the #40 JB Hollow is spliceable then I'm not sure it's worth going with hollow for the mainline over solid for this application.

    Thanks.

    p.s. are you sanding (to slightly roughen up) the part of the nylon your inserting into the hollow for the windon?

    -I still haven't had an opportunity to try splicing JB 40# hollow but have heard that it is difficult. However, it only has to be done occasionally to make an End Loop or Line to Line splice. You might want to buy some and try it.

    -If the 40# hollow works and the ABS is high enough, then you could Line to Line splice 5 to 10 yards of 60# or 80# hollow weave on top, an elegant solution.

    -If you buy 70# Daiwa Boat braid and use the method of the beginning of the thread to add a 5 to 10 yard topshot of 60# JB hollow, you will have an ABS of 65 lbs. or better.

    -Once you have the hollow topshot in place, you can go to How to Make an End Loop in Hollow-Weave Spectra for the End Loop instructions.

    -There is no need to roughen the mono/fluoro when making your own spliced leader. The challenge for full strength, is the serve, that is the difficult thing to make strong. You can see some examples of what goes wrong, here: Hollow Spectra Techniques: Analysis of Conventional Wind-On Leaders