Fighting Stance

Discussion in 'Jigging and Popping' started by pametfisher, Nov 29, 2008.

  1. pametfisher

    pametfisher Senior Member

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    I'm looking around for a rod to match up with my Stella 20K and came across this photo from a rod manufacturers web site.

    It looks like the fish (tuna?) is on the run. My question is: what's the benefit to leaning back like this?

    I know it puts a strain on the fisherman, and the rod and the guides but how much does it really help in slowing down the fish? From my experience the answer is not much at all, all most all the work is done by the drag during this phase.
     

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  2. d-a

    d-a Senior Member

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    I'm looking around for a rod to match up with my Stella 20K and came across this photo from a rod manufacturers web site.

    It looks like the fish (tuna?) is on the run. My question is: what's the benefit to leaning back like this?

    I know it puts a strain on the fisherman, and the rod and the guides but how much does it really help in slowing down the fish? From my experience the answer is not much at all, all most all the work is done by the drag during this phase.


    Thats Sami, One of the better fishermen I know.

    Leaning back like that is the same as being strapped in and leaning back only his arm is acting like the harness. While being a strain on the arm and shoulder it actually ease's the pressure on the lower back(where most tire from anyways) while putting maximum pressure on the fish. If i had to guess he has at least 22-25lbs of drag and possibly more and is just fishing standup with out the harness.

    You should try fishing with 22-25 lbs or more of drag and see for yourself why leaning back is beneficial. I know that at 30-32 lbs of drag I have to use perfect form to keep from wearing me out before the fish.

    d-a
     

  3. ksong

    ksong SPONSOR

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    To fight big fish like tuna, you should use your body and legs more than your arms. Leaning back is one of the way to get pressure to fish and get line.
    If you see how Dennis Braid fight giant by leaning back, you know how much he exercise pressure on giant.

    Sami is known to land a big tuna quickly. I am very impressed with his fighting style. He seldom use hands and use whole body while fighting. That is the right way to fight big tuna.

    YouTube - Fishing With Capt. Dom. Spinning Gear Tuna action. A wake up call from the meat grinder.
     
  4. STx Fisherman

    STx Fisherman Senior Member

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    Look at how his right arm is locked open at the elbow....straight arm. That definitely keeps your arms from fatiguing. (Cool pic).
     
  5. gman

    gman Senior Member

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    what rod manufacturing site did you see this on?? That is Sami one of teh owners of Anglers Pro Shop, he is one of the best anglers I have ever met. The reason why you lean back is to keep additional weight/pressure on the fish. It is a very smart technique because it makes the fish work that much harder.

    You can actually use your arms like a lever by locking out
     
  6. Dude-

    Dude- Junior member

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    I was fortunate enough to fish with Sami at APS. The guy is a beast. Hes got great form. You too Glen.
     
  7. pametfisher

    pametfisher Senior Member

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    I was looking at the Tenru Tuna Spike and I just went back and looked. The photo is from the Angler's Pro Shop site (not the manufacturers, my mistake). The form looks great and I have no doubt from all the comments that he knows what he's doing.

    Thanks for all the comments.
     
  8. gman

    gman Senior Member

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    I always try to put as much pain on the fish as possible, leaning back adds weight and pressure to the fish even with spinning gear and especially when using longer rods and leaning back is better than pulling with your arms as they will be the first to tire. To me that bastard fish deserves no rest, I find that one cranking/short pumping a fish at the end will really tire it down
     
  9. pametfisher

    pametfisher Senior Member

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    To fight big fish like tuna, you should use your body and legs more than your arms. Leaning back is one of the way to get pressure to fish and get line.
    If you see how Dennis Braid fight giant by leaning back, you know how much he exercise pressure on giant.

    Sami is known to land a big tuna quickly. I am very impressed with his fighting style. He seldom use hands and use whole body while fighting. That is the right way to fight big tuna.

    YouTube - Fishing With Capt. Dom. Spinning Gear Tuna action. A wake up call from the meat grinder.

    Thanks for the video, good stuff.

    I've looked at all the info on the Dennis Braid site. His use of legs and lower body looks great (Sami's too). His photos show belt and harness for conventional but not spinning reels. I've got long arms and want a lower belt to get the same leverage as his method with Spinning equipment.
     
  10. gman

    gman Senior Member

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    The technique was really made for big game fishing utilizing a bucket harness and large plate however you can still use same technique by locking arms and just leaning back to gain line. Pulling with your arms will wear you down long term. They make several spinning harnesses that are sold on Anglers Pro Shop such as the smitty shoulder harness and the Fishermans spinning harness.
     
  11. SkeeterRonnie

    SkeeterRonnie Senior Member

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    rods adds more pressure or drag to the fish. thats why i always set my drag in the position of the picture.
     
  12. pametfisher

    pametfisher Senior Member

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    The technique was really made for big game fishing utilizing a bucket harness and large plate however you can still use same technique by locking arms and just leaning back to gain line. Pulling with your arms will wear you down long term. They make several spinning harnesses that are sold on Anglers Pro Shop such as the smitty shoulder harness and the Fishermans spinning harness.

    Thank you, I went and had a look at these.

    I've been looking at different ways of positioning the belt lower to get a better geometry, meaning more pulling power with less fatigue. I'd like to get the belt gimbal a lot lower. One of the Braid belts looks possible.
     
  13. pametfisher

    pametfisher Senior Member

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    rods adds more pressure or drag to the fish. thats why i always set my drag in the position of the picture.

    I'm 57 and have been fishing since I was 5. I've always thought that the rod could be used to add a lot of pressure to the fish, and it can, until the drag starts slipping. I always set my drag with the rod bent too, for the same reason.

    Under the conditions that the fish is drawing line, I wanted to get an idea just how much the drag increased as I lifted the rod from straight out to 90 degrees. So I got off my butt, went to the garage and measured the drag at the lure, and the load at the handle of the rod. Here are the numbers I measured, photos to illustrate are below:

    Pulling line straight out:

    Case 1
    Drag at 20.5#:
    Lure drag: 20.5#
    Pull at handle: 20.5 #

    Pulling line with rod at 90 degrees to line:

    Case 1
    Drag at 20.5#
    Drag at lure: 22.5# (10% increase)
    Pull at handle: >47# (at top of my scale)

    Case 2 (drag reduced to not overload my scale)
    Drag at 10.5#
    Drag at lure: 11.5# (10% increase)
    Pull at Handle: 32#

    What I measured is that pulling back on the rod seems to increase the pressure a lot, the force on my hands roughly tripled from 10# to 30# and from 20# to over 47# (scale bottomed). However, with the drag slipping it only added about 10% to the drag on the fish--from 10# to 11# or from 20# to 22#.

    I understand that as I pull back, I could palm the reel to add more drag.
     

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  14. SkeeterRonnie

    SkeeterRonnie Senior Member

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    thats some very neat info to have. so palming the reel would be more effective at conserving your strength, than leaning back and putting a bend in the rod.... If I ever get in a long battle, I will remember that for my own endurance!
     
  15. ksong

    ksong SPONSOR

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    Leaning back is a kind of pumping effect to gain lines. It might give you more pressure, but you can do it without much effort.
    Here is my video fighting a 110-120 lbs tuna by leaning back. I didn't (couldn't) use my legs much as I fought without a fighting belt. As you see, I seldom use my arms and hands.
    I must landed the fish within 10 minutes even I didn't have a fighting belt.
    I am not a strong man with 60 years old body. :)

    When fighting big tuna, it is much effective and hurt your back less if you fight in lower position.



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  16. pametfisher

    pametfisher Senior Member

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    Leaning back is a kind of pumping effect to gain lines. It might give you more pressure, but you can do it without much effort.
    Here is my video fighting a 110-120 lbs tuna by leaning back. I didn't (couldn't) use my legs much as I fought without a fighting belt. As you see, I seldom use my arms and hands.
    I must landed the fish within 10 minutes even I didn't have a fighting belt.
    I am not a strong man with 60 years old body. :)

    When fighting big tuna, it is much effective and hurt your back less if you fight in lower position.



    That's a very good photo of technique. Low position, using legs, I think it's very good. For me, I'm 6' 3", I'd like to have the butt of the rod a little lower so my long, not too strong either, arms are straight.

    I like the shape of that rod a lot. Can you tell me which one it is?
     
  17. BretABaker

    BretABaker Guest

    Jigging Master Power Spell 350g, Saltiga 40, OTI 80lb line
     
  18. pametfisher

    pametfisher Senior Member

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    Jigging Master Power Spell 350g, Saltiga 40, OTI 80lb line

    Thank you. It's one of the rods I'm considering, maybe the 400g.

    A question for you and Kil if you don't mind--and I ask this respectfully, knowing how experienced you are with these fish--wouldn't it be a little easier to pull on the rod if the butt were a few inches lower and your arm was more perpendicular to the rod? (Geometry certainly suggests that it would.)

    I appreciate your perspectives on this.
     
  19. BretABaker

    BretABaker Guest

    well first, there are quite a few people with more experience than me...hopefully theyll chime in too :)

    but yeah it'd likely be easier.....but i did get the belt on until after i was already fighting the fish, and the boat is moving, etc etc. sometimes you've just got to improvise. here is another pic at a different point in the fight. when the fish runs under the boat - you can't keep the rod out like you normally can.

    View attachment 4835
     

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  20. ksong

    ksong SPONSOR

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    Thank you. It's one of the rods I'm considering, maybe the 400g.

    A question for you and Kil if you don't mind--and I ask this respectfully, knowing how experienced you are with these fish--wouldn't it be a little easier to pull on the rod if the butt were a few inches lower and your arm was more perpendicular to the rod? (Geometry certainly suggests that it would.)

    I appreciate your perspectives on this.
    I totally agree with you.
    The reason I didn't go lower was I didn't have a fighting belt and the rod butt touched my delicate thing if I went lower. :)

    Here is a picture of fighting a cow over 200 lbs with Smitty Spyder Harness.
    I normally can not fight over 15 minutes with normal harness as I have bad back, but I don't have any problem to fight over an hour with bucket style harness.

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