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There are only two types of people in the world...
People who think people need to be controlled, and people who want to be left alone..

1% of the people control the world
4% of the people are their puppets
5% know and try to wake the 90%
The 1% use the 4% to silence the 5% from waking up the 90%

The desire to control thoughts, forums, opinions, and anything else your biased search engine can come up with exposes the inner control freak in you HJ. You are a master at search engines and this is as far as it goes...

Your a sick SOB HJ... hope to have the fortune of not fishing with you...

BTW... what kind of smoker you have in that NJ barn... can't run a search on smokers HJ...

D-C
 

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I see you have little to no actual understanding of
how fisheries management works.
Too tired to ever teach that again.
So stick with the nanny state, collectivism, and
any other buzz words you learn from Tucker.

:)

PS> Alabama is part of a "cooperation zone"
that is managed by the GULF COUNCIL that incorporates
those 5 states, all in the gulf. What you suggest as a solution,
already exists.
I live in New York 馃崕

I see you have kept your streak alive
of being wrong 100% of the time, congrats!!!!! 馃巻馃巼馃巻馃巼馃巻

Do you happen to have a relative named Alex that lives in Florida?
actually, again, another liberal pretending they're king of the world, living in an outside state (NY...or wherever you're spewing nonsense from) telling other states how they should do their business. I stand corrected on NY. Even worse than California's governor, yours not only kills people in nursing homes, but seemingly has eveen the Democratic Party ready to burn him at the stake for sexually harassing every woman he comes in contact with. And don't get me started about de Blasio...turning murder into a spectator sport, defunding the police, killing off 60% of businesses by draconian shutdowns. No wonder you're so miserable. As for fisheries...go on praying to your Democratic gods...they've already reversed many of the policies which have made us prosperous and have kept us safe. Pretty soon we'll all be speaking Chinese and only be able to fish for hardheads and carp since they continuously destroy our fisheries.
 

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in reading past posts...it seems you like to troll the snapper season pretending you know what you're talking about. Maybe you should do a little more fishing and a little less pontificating about the size of your pea brain on this subject.
 

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I live in the Florida Panhndle and I'm not a fish expert but I have been fishing in the GOM for a long time. When I was a kid there was no limit on Red Snapper and when the coolers were filled it was time to go home. The regulations came in slowly as the catch or Red Snapper declined. In the mid to late 90's the fish were sparse and a lot smaller than they are today. The reason for bigger fish today is due to the regulations which reduced allowable catch and enabled fish to reach mature sizes. A #15 Red Snapper is about 32 inches in length and is probably round 20 years old and produces way more eggs than the the keeper #3 younger fish. On reefs I put out, maintained and didn't tell many friends about they are holding some respectable fish. Last year I fished some spots I hadn't been to in over 10 years and was shocked by the size of fish they were holding. So I would have to say that the regulations are working to build the stock and that means having a mature breeding stock.
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Discussion Starter · #25 · (Edited)
Your a sick SOB HJ... hope to have the fortune of not fishing with you...
117973


The desire to control thoughts, forums, opinions, and anything else your biased search engine can come up with exposes the inner control freak in you HJ. You are a master at search engines and this is as far as it goes...
Two decades of dealing with fisheries regulations in my part of the world
has enabled me to understand the management regimes and protocols
of how fisheries are managed. Same protocols are used all over the US,
vary slightly based on the lifestyle/cycle of the fish being managed.
If explaining how fisheries management actually works is "thought control"
then so be it. Live in the alternative universe, the 1% prefers that.
If you don't understand how the game is played, then you have no possible
chance of getting what you want.
My "biased search engine" Is the National Marine Fisheries Service database.

1% of the people control the world
4% of the people are their puppets
5% know and try to wake the 90%
The 1% use the 4% to silence the 5% from waking up the 90%
Being a 1% is not that big of a deal,
in my state is means a household income of $550,000
Not that much if you are semi competent in my part of the world,
so for full disclosure, I am a 1% member.

What you really mean is the world is controlled by the 0.001% club,
and you are correct.

We are impressed, you figured out the pieces of the puzzle, congrats.
While you do have all the pieces, you have them arranged wrong.
The 1% and 4% are the minions by the nature of the game to the 0.001%
we conform to the direction they are steering the ship.

Now here are the ways you arranged the pieces incorrectly.
The 0.001% and the 1% and 5% ARE NOT trying to silence
the "woke" 5%, it just seems that way, because the 90% really doesn't care,
they believe what they believe, and you are not changing their minds.
This applies to right or left, conservative or liberal.

Also, while the 0.001, 1 and 5% can sit on either side of the fence,
it is no different than the Crips and Bloods fighting over turf to push their drugs.
The GOP and the DEMS are the crips and bloods,
just pushing different flavors of drugs,
depending on what the users prefer as their drug.

Now, people like Rachel, Tucker, Rush, Cuomo, Alex Jones, etc
are all gang members from different gangs,
and are part of the 1-5% crowd, the minions for the people in control.
They exist to appeal to the 90% and the "woke" 5% as well
from both sides of the fence, again, pick your drug of choice,
and that decides what side of the fence you are on.
Ultimately, the 0.0001% don't care what side, as they control and profit off both.

You might be aware of some or all of the above,
so I'm going to let you in on a little secret,
which involves the "woke" 5%, your group.

So right now, Dr. Suess and Mr. Potato Head is in your mind
and conscious enough, that you have feelings about it and need to mention
it on this site. Warning the uniformed of the futures perils of this path we are taking,
you are part of the woke or aware 5%.
Yet, where did you learn this information/mindset from, the 1-5%,
who's job is to control the 90%, you just chose the lesser used
drug and not the main stream drug of choice for your side of the fence.

So, the woke 5% is not really that woke,
and exactly why nobody is really trying to silence them,
because besides believing a complementary/beneficial message for the 0.001%,
they know, the 90% won't listen anyway,
because ultimately the 90% believe they are woke.


PS> when 70 million of ya'll show up to prove you are "woke"
you can't actually be the "woke 5%" when you represent about 50% of the vote.
117974
 

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Discussion Starter · #26 ·
What kind of fishery do anglers want?


The Red Snapper fishery of the late 80's and 90's
where you had liberal bag limits,
but it was difficult for the average angler to even catch one.
Making fishing for RS kind of boring and not a rewarding experience
for the average angler.

or

The Red Snapper fishery of today,
where conservative bag limits and season length,
but have a vibrant and exciting fishery,
where average angler can catch RS with consistency,
young anglers get lots of action, potentially bringing them into the sport,
instead of being bored waiting for a bite all day.
Opportunity to bring home fish to eat on every trip.

or

Increase the harvest to appease a small segment of anglers,
and start the path back to option one.

How it kind of works everywhere, today and in the past,
and with almost every fish.
 
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Discussion Starter · #27 ·
actually, again, another xxxxxx pretending they're king of the world, living in an outside state (NY...or wherever you're spewing nonsense from) telling other states how they should do their business.
Maybe you ought to focus on the homeless population
and rampant drug problems
or the draconian lockdowns your governor has you in
And don't get me started about de Blasio...turning murder into a spectator sport, defunding the police, killing off 60% of businesses by draconian shutdowns.
117975


PS> Since the Chinese will be taking over, which might be true,
kind of what happens when one country looks to the future,
and another country looks backwards towards coal and is anti big tech,
in preparation for this change, I guess me liking Asian/Chinese food
helps in this case, I was wondering if I should learn Mandarin or Cantonese?
thanks. xie xie 璋㈣阿
 

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What kind of fishery do anglers want?


The Red Snapper fishery of the late 80's and 90's
where you had liberal bag limits,
but it was difficult for the average angler to even catch one.
Making fishing for RS kind of boring and not a rewarding experience
for the average angler.

or

The Red Snapper fishery of today,
where conservative bag limits and season length,
but have a vibrant and exciting fishery,
where average angler can catch RS with consistency,
young anglers get lots of action, potentially bringing them into the sport,
instead of being bored waiting for a bite all day.
Opportunity to bring home fish to eat on every trip.

or

Increase the harvest to appease a small segment of anglers,
and start the path back to option one.

How it kind of works everywhere, today and in the past,
and with almost every fish.
you missed what anglers REALLY want: A system that uses REAL science to determine quotas...not the wild ass guessing of NOAA. States have effectively been doing this using apps like iSnapper for a couple of years. Recreational fishermen do NOT want to be pitted against commercial fishermen who actually weigh their catches. They also want a reasonable season. 3-11 days is ridiculous based on what every angler knows is an overpopulation of red snapper. It's nearly impossible to catch trigger fish, mangroves or vermillion in most areas of TX and Florida because the red snapper population is so thick. Again, you have NO experience fishing in TX or Florida as is evidenced by your inane and pompous nonsensical posts applauding liberals for mismanaging the fishery. Stick to what you know personally versus pretending that Google is always factually correct. THIS is what is still happening, regardless of your inaccurate NYC posts. Kingpins of the Gulf make millions off red snapper harvest without ever going fishing - al.com
 

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Discussion Starter · #29 · (Edited)
you missed what anglers REALLY want: A system that uses REAL science to determine quotas...not the wild ass guessing of NOAA. States have effectively been doing this using apps like iSnapper for a couple of years.
Well, that report that is coming out, that you have been requoting, "The Great Snapper Count",
the one that says "3x more fish" the full report has not been issued yet, due in April,
but what else that report has said is,
where the new count surveyed fish, the same area that the fed had done,
the new survey found similar fish counts/density as the feds,
validating previous fed counting methods as accurate
.

As for the 3x part, the report did not say that,
it said "UP TO" 3x the amount of fish. This number will be an
extrapolation of a few areas, across thousands of similar areas,
to come up with a new estimate, which will need to be peer reviewed
before it can be used by the fisheries manager.
These new fish is based on counting in areas they previously did not survey.

Will this result in a calculation of more RS in the ocean, yes,
does that equate to higher quotas for fishermen, yes, maybe,
and also maybe not, or not as much as you might think.
While the amount of the additional fish will matter,
the most important factor will be THEIR AGE.

If they found predominately younger fish, age 5 and under,
it will have very little effect on quotas, even if there is 3x more of them.

What you and most fishermen don't understand is,
NOAA is aware there is plenty of RS in the ocean.
The problem is the AGE STRUCTURE of the population is not stratified properly.
There is an overabundance of younger sub 10 year old fish,
and a shortage of older 20+ year old fish.
Until the population of older fish is increased to the level required by the fishery
to remain healthy and sustainable, and along with federal laws, based on science,
the fishery will be fishing under some restricted harvest,
so these younger fish can survive in the quantities necessary to meet these goals.
With a long lived fish like RS, that take time,
about 8 more years probably to reach those goals.


Again, you have NO experience fishing in TX or Florida as is evidenced by your inane and pompous nonsensical posts applauding liberals for mismanaging the fishery. Stick to what you know personally versus pretending that Google is always factually correct.
I've fished Texas twice, both time shallow water redfish.
Never did offshore from TX, because I can catch the same fish at home,
and if I want to run 100 miles to the grounds, I can do that from home too.

Purchased my first go fast boat, a Contender in the early 90's, direct
from Contender, was semi custom, the top mounted hatch to access the
locker my was my original design, first contender with it was mine.
Boat was finished in late fall, trucked to NY, had local racing shop install
the motors, debugged, trucked boat back to Florida for 3 months,
and would fly down and fish for a week or so, several times.
Did this for 5 years. Fished from Boca Inlet and also brought
the boat to several of the keys.
Also did several commercial red snapper trips with my friend, in the gulf,
multi day trips with a 5,000 pound trip limit at the time.
So, not a local, but got a bit of a clue.

They also want a reasonable season. 3-11 days is ridiculous based on what every angler knows is an overpopulation of red snapper. It's nearly impossible to catch trigger fish, mangroves or vermillion in most areas of TX and Florida because the red snapper population is so thick.
Those super short seasons were the result of the states overfishing their quotas in state waters,
which then reduced the amount the fish quota available in Federal waters. Zero sum game,
take too much inshore, loose similar amount from the offshore/fed quota.
Take too many fish this year, you pay back those fish next year with an equal amount reduced from the quota.
Works the same for the comms.
For a guy who lives in a state with a year round state season,
4 fish bag limit at 15 inches,
a situation no other state enjoys,
you certainly find a lot to complain about,
more, more, more, more..........




Recreational fishermen do NOT want to be pitted against commercial fishermen who actually weigh their catches.
Kingpins of the Gulf make millions off red snapper harvest without ever going fishing - al.com
You seem to be stuck on this weighting issue.
The reason the NMFS does not weight the recreational catch
either with their surveys or require the states to do so, is two fold.
First, the Fed have measured and weighted hundreds of thousands of
fish that have been caught during surveys, They know they weight range
of every size of fish. So when a 16" fish is submitted, they use a predetermined
weight for 16" fish, which is an average of thousands of 16" they weighted measured.
Second, not having to weight a fish at the dock, speeds up the interview process with the
angler, and it allows them to survey more anglers per day, which is important.
In addition, when states calculate out their season length, they use the average weight
of all snapper caught in their state, divide that by their quota/tac and come up witth a season length,
based on anticipated effort and average weight.
Commericals do not measure fish, they weight fish,
so they weight their fish as pounds, just that simple.
Nobody is trying to scam anybody, just the method of counting/estimating employed,
which is pretty standard in this country and many others.

I posted that article several years ago, and it was discussed at length on this site.
If you actually believe what you say, you don't want to be pitted against commercial fishermen,
then why do you care how they distribute their share of the fish?
Basically a 50/50 split, rec get their, split it amongst the states, some say unfairly.
And the comms split up their 50%,
why should you care how they split it up, or who owns what,
its not your fish, and basically not your concern.
Unless of course, that old, "I want more" thing is popping up,
and you don't think the comms should get 50%,
well in that case, you are directly pitting yourself/recs against the comms.
Might I suggest reviewing the meaning of Hypocrisy once again. :)
 

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again...come try to catch a keeper in state water. I'll give you a dollar for each keeper state water red snapper you can catch between March and November in TX state waters north of Matagorda. They're mostly non-existent and don't contribute squat to our quota...AGAIN, you don't live here or any of the gulf coastal states, so please STFU about stuff you obviously know NOTHING about, nor have any REAL personal experience with. As for sector sharing...the government just "guesses" when the recreational fishermen have met their quota. 2019 is a good example. There were approximately 5 fishable days during Federal Snapper Season on a 30 day season. Even if everyone who went out on those 5 days limited on 30lb snapper, the quota wouldn't have even been close to being met...yet magically with ZERO facts, the season only lasted 30 days. Last year the first fishable day in the season that was to be from June 1 to August 2nd, there were ZERO fishable days in June and only 8 or 10 in July. (fishable days are when seas are less than 3-4ft and the average offshore boat can go out). Again, the recreational quota is made up of guessing while the commercial quota is made up by commercial fishermen weighing their catch. You admit to ZERO experience fishing for red snapper here while pontificating that you're an expert. Buy a ticket, come to TX and I'll take you fishing in state water anywhere from Matagorda to Galveston. The only keeper fish you'll likely catch are hardheads and sand trout.
 

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as to the "age of the fish". These are the average size I've caught off my bay boat 2-30 miles offshore in the last two years...and no, we don't have to weed through 100 undersize or juvenile
117980

fish to catch big fish.
 

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Discussion Starter · #32 · (Edited)
again...come try to catch a keeper in state water. I'll give you a dollar for each keeper state water red snapper you can catch between March and November in TX state waters north of Matagorda. They're mostly non-existent and don't contribute squat to our quota...AGAIN, you don't live here or any of the gulf coastal states, so please STFU about stuff you obviously know NOTHING about,
In 2019, latest year available with complete data at NMFS,
82% of the RS quota was harvested in STATE WATERS in the Gulf.
This number generally is around 80-85% every year.
While your experiences are yours, they are not representative of the fishery as a whole.
Maybe try to be a little less self centered,
and realize there bit more out there than just your little part of the gulf.
Maybe time to take some of your own advise;
"so please STFU about stuff you obviously know NOTHING about"




As for sector sharing...the government just "guesses" when the recreational fishermen have met their quota. 2019 is a good example. There were approximately 5 fishable days during Federal Snapper Season on a 30 day season. Even if everyone who went out on those 5 days limited on 30lb snapper, the quota wouldn't have even been close to being met...yet magically with ZERO facts, the season only lasted 30 days. Last year the first fishable day in the season that was to be from June 1 to August 2nd, there were ZERO fishable days in June and only 8 or 10 in July. (fishable days are when seas are less than 3-4ft and the average offshore boat can go out)
2019 harvest data was collected by the STATES using their programs like Isnapper, snappercheck, etc.
EXACTLY WHAT YOU DESIRE, LOCAL government doing the counting.
You are completely unaware of this, much like everything else.
But never let reality get in the way of your grievances and theories.


Again, the recreational quota is made up of guessing while the commercial quota is made up by commercial fishermen weighing their catch.
You mean recreational HARVEST, not quota.
Again, the reasons for the different methods were explained to you,
and you choose to ignore it, and continue with the mindless grievances.
Using an average weight for a certain size fish when calculating the harvest
is very accurate and a technique used in many countries, as it works.
When they are dealing with around 1 million fish on the rec side,
using average weight is statistically accurate,
for 10 fish, no, for 1 million, yes.

By the way, the average size RS harvested in the Gulf is
8.2 pounds


.As for sector sharing..
Again with sector sharing. I have no idea what you mean.
If you are talking about the rec/comm split of the quota,
that is not sector sharing.

If you are talking about the rec half of the quota,
being divided between the private anglers and
for hire fleet.
That was negotiated and approved by the Gulf Council,
your LOCAL representatives, from each state,
who "know best" arranged that deal on your behalf,
not the feds.


Have a wonderful season.
 

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Discussion Starter · #33 · (Edited)
as to the "age of the fish". These are the average size I've caught off my bay boat 2-30 miles offshore in the last two years...and no, we don't have to weed through 100 undersize or juvenile View attachment 117980
fish to catch big fish.
"2-30 miles offshore"

2-9 miles is in state waters,
where you just got done telling us its impossible to catch a keeper,
now those same waters encompasses 1/3 the fishing zone you mention
where you catch keeper fish.
Just pointing out, the contradiction, as usual, in your statement(s)

117983



Kind of hard to tell the size of the fish you are showing,
DID YOU HURT YOUR BACK?
Stiff arming those fish towards to the camera to make them look bigger.
I can tell you are trying extra hard in the photo,
can even see your shoulders pulled in,
so you can push the fish even closer to the camera to make look even larger.

While you might not be aware,
this is kind of how googans/newbs/clowns take pictures of fish, just sayin.

To me, they look like 12-14 pound fish at best,
you probably label them 20-24 pounds.

CluelessJack :)

PS> since you are so into "measuring"
HOW MANY INCHES LONG ARE THEY?
and
HOW OLD ARE THEY?
 

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Discussion Starter · #37 ·
HJ, bait fishing is not allowed in 360. Or were you slow pitch jigging 馃槅馃ぃ.
Do you even have to ask? :)

Testing out my new 720 degree circular wrapped,
bent butt SPJ nano orbital helix carbon fiber rod.
The guides are wrapped 360 degrees around the rod,
two times before reaching the tip top.
Eliminating all rod twist
and capturing the torqueing action and converting it into stored energy
which is released through the 16 guides on the rod in a circular/orbital arrangement,
transferring this energy to the rod,
to increase lifting power when fighting a fish.
Going to call it the Texas Tornado



LMAO on your image above.
 
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that was 20-30 miles...mistyped...and both of those snapper were 13lbs a piece, not small juvenile snapper as you seem to think only exist. You act like they're endangered...ridiculous. As for the "googan" comment...you can shove that one Hungry Jerk. Your fishing probably consists of perch jerking at best. Again, there are so many snapper in the gulf that you can't get to bottom on any spot in Federal water up to 300ft that isn't loaded with snapper. I'm sorry but a liberal new yorker who has fished in the gulf like twice in his life is about as ignorant and egotistical as they come. There are no "scientific studies" about snapper catches and not certain where you get your idiot ass numbers on state water but they're absolutely inaccurate. Again...put your money where your mouth is AngryJerk and come fish for snapper here or in Florida or Alabama or Louisiana...you'll see the gulf is overloaded with a fish population the feds have mismanaged for years...Federal mismanagement of red snapper draws attention of Congress 鈥 CCA Mississippi Thankfully under Trump, the states finally DID get some say on a season...but again the quota which is made up by wild ass guesses and NOT science on recreational catches is controlled by an inept government. You're probably the guy who voted for Obamacare too and thinks that MSNBC and CNN are real news agencies. Done with your idiocy...go back to jerking yourself off and pretending you know something.
 

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Bragging about the size of fish you have to long arm leaves a bit to be desired.
Not bragging Kim...just proving a point that the red snapper fishery is mismanaged by the feds and that every reef/wreck is overloaded with fish...no matter how much HJ spews nonsense he has ZERO personal experience with.
 

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Discussion Starter · #40 ·
Not bragging Kim...just proving a point that the red snapper fishery is mismanaged by the feds and that every reef/wreck is overloaded with fish...no matter how much HJ spews nonsense he has ZERO personal experience with.
Yeah @Kim, wise up there,
straight arming fish to show off,
is solid proof the feds mismanaged the fishery.
Picture was taken months ago, in preparation for this thread,
as proof of fed mismanagement.

Those of us with personal experience in the RS fishery,
know its best to straight arm average size fish when bragging about our skills.
All the cool fishermen do it, get with the program.
 
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