Penn Torque

Gunsmoke

I don't believe it, I just got an electronic invoice from Charkbait. The Torque's shipped out today. The nice thing about Charkbait, is if you don't order any line on the reel, and you have the Captain's card, you get 40 bucks off each Torque. That 10% off really adds up. Problem is I have to give Mrbill one for losing a bet. In a couple of days, I'll see if they live up the icast award "Best of Show."

ksong · 11-21-2006, 09:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tunanorth

I have used the TRQ300 since June and the TRQ200 since September.
Have caught many yellowtail, wahoo, yellowfin tuna to 95 pounds, striped marlin to 175 pounds, amberjack, pargo, etc. on TRQ300, and lots of the same stuff to 60 pounds on the 200.
Go ahead and use the reel for amberjack!
The fast cranking will get you more bites, and although I have not caught any real big AJ's with it, I have caught several of their "first cousins" yellowtail that were well over 40 pounds with it.
I've also caught AJ's to 82 pounds in the past, so I know what you're up against.
Plenty of cranking power, however, be sure to change the handle to the "outermost" hole position.
It may be that the angler using the "demo model" on the Indy still had the handle in the original position.
Not really sure why anybody even needs that innermost "speed" position for a reel with a high gear ratio.

Thanks for your input. It is natural to have different opinions on the same reel depending on your preferences and experiences.

That is why we need discussion. I had a great expection on the new Torgue reels because I was looking for small powerful star drag reels as most jigging reels I have max drag upto 25 lbs and are not strong enough to handle over 150 lbs tuna.

But the high gear ratio of 6.3:1 and the short handle turned me off. For tuna jigging high gear ratio is not necessary and cranking power to fight a big tuna is more important. No matter what others insist, I don't believe high gear ratio with great cranking power. Penn should have given choices to users between high gear ratio and low gear ratio as there are many fishermen who don't need high gear ratio like for bottom fishing or tuna fishing.

When a reel has a max drag of 27 lbs, any reel can handle a big fish under 200 lbs fish if the line capacity is not a problem. The problem is how you fight effectively. If you think the high gear ratio Torgue reel has good cranking power, I wonder how good the low gear ratio Torgue reel would be.

My friend who fished on the Independence is not novice fisherman. He has many years tuna experiences and caught many tuna on jigs using Saltiga 40/50 or Ocea Jigger 4000P. He is not dummy to use innermost "speed" position.

When he said he had hard time to turn the handle with 50 lbs wahoo, I was a little surprised as I had no such an issue when I fought 86 lbs wahoo on a jig on my Saltiga 50.
The other concern of Torgue reel was the castability as I thought the spool is pretty heavy. But he said the reel cast pretty good.

As there are new small, but powerful reels like Alutecnos 12 Golilla or two speed Accurate Boss reels available and Avet Woo-X is coming, the market of single high speed reel will have severe competition.

86 lbs wahoo caught on Saltiga 50 at Midnight Lumps out of Veince, LA

Tunanorth · 11-21-2006, 11:41 AM

Ksong,
I've seen your posts regarding a search for a jigging reel for 150 to 250-plus size tuna.
No doubt a 2-speed is going to be your only choice for such a reel, I certainly don't make the claim that a Torque or any other 1-speed will be suitable for that.
In the setting of the San Diego long-range fleet, a few bigger tuna have been caught on single-speeds intended for wahoo, but a lot of luck was involved.
Having caught numerous bigger tuna standup-style on traditional gear, including "back in the day" when 2-speed reels did not exist, I almost shudder at the thought of returning to the 1-speeds even with the modern engineering advances.
I have a fairly good dialogue going with the Penn engineering dept, and they do keep teasing me with cryptic references to upcoming "surprises", I can only speculate what might be coming.
Possibly different gear ratios or perhaps a stamped/diecast version with a lower price tag like the Trinidad/Torium split.
Also, the upcoming 12VSX and 8VSX will be high-drag 2 speeds with mid gear ratios, could be a viable answer, not sure on weights.
All that said, I believe the high gear ratio versions should have been the first ones out, given that most people want/need it for the majority of their jigging uses.
Having caught tuna to 95 pounds with the TRQ300, I would not recommend it **or any 1-speed** for tuna much past the 140-150 pound range, even though it develops plenty of drag for that use.
For anybody who might be in the San Diego area on Saturday December 2, I will be presenting the "Jig Fishing on 3 to 10 Day Long Range Trips" seminar at Fisherman's Landing at the "Tackle Day" event.
I would be happy to go "in depth" to discuss the new reels, new vs. old style jigs, changing hooks or whatever.

ksong · 11-21-2006, 03:50 PM

Tunanorth,
Thanks again for your reply.
As a fisherman I like to try many different reels, different jigs or different jigging techniques.

The reason I prefer using small, light reels for relatively heavy fish is not because those small reels are better suited, but because of the necessity.
As a full time jigger, I can not hold heavy reels for long period time.
If someone wants to jig in Hurricane Bank where tuna are big and relatively easily to catch, bigger reels like Penn12VS are better choices as he doesn't have to jig for long period time. Penn 12VS is very popular for jigging on the Canyon Runner, the most successful charter operations on the East Coast, as they normally jig only when they see tuna marks on the screen.

We learned we can fight big tuna on those small reels. It can not explained by logic or theory. Very few tuna in 50-70 lbs range can last over 5 minutes even though I use small reels and 7'-8' rods. In fact guys who use 50 take more time oftenly than I do.

Even though we catch same tuna on jigs, we use different jigging techniques among the East Coast fishermen, West Coast fishermnen and Japanese fishermen. I can not say which techniques are better than the others. All those technigues have been developed for many years and have their own places.

Rob M · 11-22-2006, 05:04 AM

Thanks for the update there Gunsmoke, we have not received them down under as yet and can't wait.

Tunanorth thanks for the inside info.

mcgolfer · 11-22-2006, 07:43 AM

welcome tunanorth. thanks for your inside track on what is going on with penn. with the general gulf tuna being 100 lbs or less it does give us many viable options. almost any quality single speed with 6 to 1 or lower gearing can handle these tuna. however when venturing to places in the gulf that are known to hold larger fish (the lump) then these single speeds can cost you fish. not being able to gain line with the higher gear ratios allows the fish to regain its strength and prolong the fight. not a good thing as the longer that fish is on the more bad things that are likely to happen.

with the newer and smaller 2 speeds that are available now you have lots of reel choices that are light enough to jig with most of the day. they also have gear ratios that allow you to move a jig quickly and a gear that allows you to move the fish in your direction once hooked up. nothing is more tiring than trying to turn a 6 to 1 reel handle that doesn't what to move.

also i find that with the right rod and reel combination the angler can put the pressure on the fish instead of the fish putting the pressure on you. with the new spinners having the drag capacities they now have and the rod builders making heavier action spinning rods i can actually chunk fish with a spinning outfit for our average gulf tuna's. there is alway a lot of talk about the new reels but the new rod technoligies are just as amazing. we fished with some rods this past weekend that weigh less than most bass rods and were hammering the tuna with them......rick

DeepBlueGulf · 11-25-2006, 06:49 PM

I had a chance to see the Torque 200 at Roy's Bait and Tackle today, and it is a very nice reel! The fit and finish is excellent and everything feels very smooth. I had been wondering what the size of the 200 would compare to and it is very much about the size of a Torium 20, only the spool is narrower by about 25% and the frame is thick and massive. The reel is considerably heavier than a Trini20, and after feeling the weight we put it on the scale and it weighed 27 ounces, 7 ounces more than the advertised 20 ounces.

We tried to see what the freespool was like, but there was too much grease everywhere to let it spin more than about 15 revolutions before stopping. The range on the drag felt really good, you can crank it down, and crank it down some more, and there is still more to crank down! The guys at Roy's offered to spool it up so we could test the drags, but we didn't have time to do it.

Price wasn't as bad as I would have thought, list was $389, but Roy's has a 10% off reels sale going till Christmas, so that would have brought the price down to $350.

Reel looks like it will fish well, and is high quality and looks great, but I'll wait for a buddy to buy one so that I can try it, I'm still interested in seeing the Avet HOOX before I buy another reel.

DBG

Snagged · 12-04-2006, 09:11 PM

Problems?
http://www.allcoastsportfishing.com/...d=164359&page=

ksong · 12-04-2006, 09:55 PM

MrBill,
I don't think the problem posted on Allcost is not serious one and can be fixed by Penn without much problem. Any new reels can have minor bugs.
Avet also had some minor problems when their products came out first.

One guy posted on Allcoast he is going to use Torgue 200 for salmon or albacore.
I just don't get it why he needs a reel with 33 lbs drag to catch them.

I think I can catch a 100 lbs tuna on Torgue 200.

Tunanorth · 12-05-2006, 02:40 PM

What's especially interesting is that there is substantial "overlap" of posters/readers between many saltwater fishing websites.
In reality there have been just a handful of these failures, but the stories are repeated over and over on various websites.
Penn is being extremely forthright about what is happening, and is committed to getting it taken care of.
If the bearing adjustment is left within the normal 3 to 7/1000's tolerances, the situation is non-existent.
None of the field-test reels experienced this, and the simple engineering fix is to put in a positive stop on the adjustment, i.e. shorter threads.
No shafts have "shattered", but the spindles bent due to the constant rubbing allowed by the excessive play.
If any current reel experiences this, they should NOT send it to the repair dept, but should send it to the Penn Engineering dept, attn. Dave Martin or Pete Yaskowski for immediate attention.

Ragman · 12-05-2006, 06:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tunanorth

Penn is being extremely forthright about what is happening, and is committed to getting it taken care of.
If the bearing adjustment is left within the normal 3 to 7/1000's tolerances, the situation is non-existent.

Thanks for the response Tunanorth! After reading different sites, it seems that the solution is easy.

I only have a couple of Penn spinners (inshore), but I think this Penn Torque will be my first Penn conventional!

It was nice to read that David Martin returned a telephone call in one hour and took care of the customer's needs himself.

You cannot buy, hire, or teach that level of service, it just comes naturally with some people.

11-22-2006, 07:43 AM	#25 (permalink)
mcgolfer Senior Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: antlers oklahoma Posts: 411	welcome tunanorth. thanks for your inside track on what is going on with penn. with the general gulf tuna being 100 lbs or less it does give us many viable options. almost any quality single speed with 6 to 1 or lower gearing can handle these tuna. however when venturing to places in the gulf that are known to hold larger fish (the lump) then these single speeds can cost you fish. not being able to gain line with the higher gear ratios allows the fish to regain its strength and prolong the fight. not a good thing as the longer that fish is on the more bad things that are likely to happen. with the newer and smaller 2 speeds that are available now you have lots of reel choices that are light enough to jig with most of the day. they also have gear ratios that allow you to move a jig quickly and a gear that allows you to move the fish in your direction once hooked up. nothing is more tiring than trying to turn a 6 to 1 reel handle that doesn't what to move. also i find that with the right rod and reel combination the angler can put the pressure on the fish instead of the fish putting the pressure on you. with the new spinners having the drag capacities they now have and the rod builders making heavier action spinning rods i can actually chunk fish with a spinning outfit for our average gulf tuna's. there is alway a lot of talk about the new reels but the new rod technoligies are just as amazing. we fished with some rods this past weekend that weigh less than most bass rods and were hammering the tuna with them......rick __________________ there is no limit on tackle

12-04-2006, 09:11 PM	#27 (permalink)
Snagged Senior Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 1,048	Problems? http://www.allcoastsportfishing.com/...d=164359&page= __________________ Jerry Uh oh, Snagged again!

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11-21-2006, 11:41 AM	#22 (permalink)
Tunanorth Junior member Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 14	Ksong, I've seen your posts regarding a search for a jigging reel for 150 to 250-plus size tuna. No doubt a 2-speed is going to be your only choice for such a reel, I certainly don't make the claim that a Torque or any other 1-speed will be suitable for that. In the setting of the San Diego long-range fleet, a few bigger tuna have been caught on single-speeds intended for wahoo, but a lot of luck was involved. Having caught numerous bigger tuna standup-style on traditional gear, including "back in the day" when 2-speed reels did not exist, I almost shudder at the thought of returning to the 1-speeds even with the modern engineering advances. I have a fairly good dialogue going with the Penn engineering dept, and they do keep teasing me with cryptic references to upcoming "surprises", I can only speculate what might be coming. Possibly different gear ratios or perhaps a stamped/diecast version with a lower price tag like the Trinidad/Torium split. Also, the upcoming 12VSX and 8VSX will be high-drag 2 speeds with mid gear ratios, could be a viable answer, not sure on weights. All that said, I believe the high gear ratio versions should have been the first ones out, given that most people want/need it for the majority of their jigging uses. Having caught tuna to 95 pounds with the TRQ300, I would not recommend it or any 1-speed for tuna much past the 140-150 pound range, even though it develops plenty of drag for that use. For anybody who might be in the San Diego area on Saturday December 2, I will be presenting the "Jig Fishing on 3 to 10 Day Long Range Trips" seminar at Fisherman's Landing at the "Tackle Day" event. I would be happy to go "in depth" to discuss the new reels, new vs. old style jigs, changing hooks or whatever.

11-21-2006, 03:50 PM	#23 (permalink)
ksong Senior Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 1,284	Tunanorth, Thanks again for your reply. As a fisherman I like to try many different reels, different jigs or different jigging techniques. The reason I prefer using small, light reels for relatively heavy fish is not because those small reels are better suited, but because of the necessity. As a full time jigger, I can not hold heavy reels for long period time. If someone wants to jig in Hurricane Bank where tuna are big and relatively easily to catch, bigger reels like Penn12VS are better choices as he doesn't have to jig for long period time. Penn 12VS is very popular for jigging on the Canyon Runner, the most successful charter operations on the East Coast, as they normally jig only when they see tuna marks on the screen. We learned we can fight big tuna on those small reels. It can not explained by logic or theory. Very few tuna in 50-70 lbs range can last over 5 minutes even though I use small reels and 7'-8' rods. In fact guys who use 50 take more time oftenly than I do. Even though we catch same tuna on jigs, we use different jigging techniques among the East Coast fishermen, West Coast fishermnen and Japanese fishermen. I can not say which techniques are better than the others. All those technigues have been developed for many years and have their own places.

11-22-2006, 05:04 AM	#24 (permalink)
Rob M Junior member Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 3	Thanks for the update there Gunsmoke, we have not received them down under as yet and can't wait. Tunanorth thanks for the inside info.

11-25-2006, 06:49 PM	#26 (permalink)
DeepBlueGulf Senior Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 612	I had a chance to see the Torque 200 at Roy's Bait and Tackle today, and it is a very nice reel! The fit and finish is excellent and everything feels very smooth. I had been wondering what the size of the 200 would compare to and it is very much about the size of a Torium 20, only the spool is narrower by about 25% and the frame is thick and massive. The reel is considerably heavier than a Trini20, and after feeling the weight we put it on the scale and it weighed 27 ounces, 7 ounces more than the advertised 20 ounces. We tried to see what the freespool was like, but there was too much grease everywhere to let it spin more than about 15 revolutions before stopping. The range on the drag felt really good, you can crank it down, and crank it down some more, and there is still more to crank down! The guys at Roy's offered to spool it up so we could test the drags, but we didn't have time to do it. Price wasn't as bad as I would have thought, list was $389, but Roy's has a 10% off reels sale going till Christmas, so that would have brought the price down to $350. Reel looks like it will fish well, and is high quality and looks great, but I'll wait for a buddy to buy one so that I can try it, I'm still interested in seeing the Avet HOOX before I buy another reel. DBG

12-04-2006, 09:55 PM	#28 (permalink)
ksong Senior Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 1,284	MrBill, I don't think the problem posted on Allcost is not serious one and can be fixed by Penn without much problem. Any new reels can have minor bugs. Avet also had some minor problems when their products came out first. One guy posted on Allcoast he is going to use Torgue 200 for salmon or albacore. I just don't get it why he needs a reel with 33 lbs drag to catch them. I think I can catch a 100 lbs tuna on Torgue 200.

12-05-2006, 02:40 PM	#29 (permalink)
Tunanorth Junior member Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 14	What's especially interesting is that there is substantial "overlap" of posters/readers between many saltwater fishing websites. In reality there have been just a handful of these failures, but the stories are repeated over and over on various websites. Penn is being extremely forthright about what is happening, and is committed to getting it taken care of. If the bearing adjustment is left within the normal 3 to 7/1000's tolerances, the situation is non-existent. None of the field-test reels experienced this, and the simple engineering fix is to put in a positive stop on the adjustment, i.e. shorter threads. No shafts have "shattered", but the spindles bent due to the constant rubbing allowed by the excessive play. If any current reel experiences this, they should NOT send it to the repair dept, but should send it to the Penn Engineering dept, attn. Dave Martin or Pete Yaskowski for immediate attention.

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